Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Discussion of the classic series of Doctor Who hosted by Planet Mondas Forum.

My Honest Feeling is That He Miscast........ (Up to 3 votes allowed.)

Peter Davison
4
15%
Colin Baker
10
38%
Sylvester McCoy
6
23%
None of them. He knew a good Doctor when he saw one!
6
23%
 
Total votes : 26

Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:51 pm

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JNT was a man who made mistakes.

From costumes to some dubious story choices....



But did any of those mistakes extend to the central casting of the show?

And, if so, what do you feel was wrong with his choice - or choices?



Hand on heart - and putting aside nostalgia - do you think he messed up in any of his main three choices of lead actor?



Or did he at least get that aspect right every single time?




You have as many votes as you need....
:)







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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Wed Nov 20, 2019 3:20 pm

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I have to say, sadly, Colin imo.

A stage performance in a tv studio. No subtlety. No nuance.

Replace the coat - and I think he would still, sadly, have purposefully and blindly continued his occasionally bellowing, ridiculous over-acting.

I don't believe in this retro-suggested thing that there was a seven year plan to "peel the banana" either, gradually showing why Sixie was the way he was (which was a theatrical bully, basically). Only Colin has ever suggested that there was such a plan. (And it never made sense to me anyway; the Doctor is one entity: why would only the Colin Doctor have some dreadful secret that was gradually revealed?) :?

I honestly think we were about to be subjected to seven or eight years of the Baker Doctor being loudly unpleasant to everyone around him from first story to last - and unsubtle "LOOK AT ME, I AM ACTING/REACTING!" performances throughout.

I think the 18 month suspension took the blustery wind out of Colin's sails somewhat - and would suggest that his Doctor throughout TRIAL, rather than an acting choice, is actually an actor and character who has had the confidence knocked somewhat out of him by real life circumstances; who has lost that over-confident edge of Season 22. Witness Colin's sweat-soaked interview on WOGAN at the time to see an actor under terrible pressure.

I have to concede that there was something wonderful to behold in the enormous confidence of his Season 22 Doctor, but another seven seasons of that would imo have been a nightmare!

Instead we got a mortally wounded performance in Season 23, before the killing blow phone call from JNT.

I think JNT had lost perspective when he cast Colin. While there are some subtle elements (which I think JNT saw) in Colin's character that would make a good Doctor - witty, quick witted, intelligent, larger than life, mischievous look to the eyes..... I don't think that that is what we were going to get. We were going to get eight years of brash, loud acting and an enthusiastic engagement with murderous violence in any offered scripts - and only Michael Grade and Jonathan Powell were about to save us from that. :(

Maybe there should have been an audition/screen test first - rather than just offering Colin the part after a party?

"I'd be more keen to blame the costume than the performance!" lamented JNT years later. "Okay, so I got it wrong, I got it wrong!"

But he doesn't totally let the performance off the hook, with his careful wording.


______________________________________________________________________________________________


If it were not for the fact that he is an excellent actor, I would suggest that Peter was also an extremely odd choice for the Doctor. But, being a good actor, he was able to come at the character from an angle that no actor had before, showing a vulnerability to the Doctor for the first time, which subsequent actors have explored further. So I don't think Peter was miscast; just a brave choice and breaking new ground.

Sylvester has a natural eccentricity which informs his performance, so that's a great plus right there. Not the greatest actor in the world and have always found his attempts at shouting embarrassing (THERE - WILL - BE - NO - BATTLE - HERE!!!!!!!!) , but I can't honestly say he was actually miscast in any way, shape or form.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Bowtiesarecool » Wed Nov 20, 2019 3:46 pm

I liked them all. I just wish there was more time to develop Colin Baker's Doctor.
The Doctor died with Capaldi. The Chibnall era is non-canon.

There are no Doctors before William Hartnell.

Without respect, we reject.

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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby DSJR » Wed Nov 20, 2019 3:53 pm

I see where the poster above is coming from, but for myself looking back, I put the blame on direction myself. I'm sure Colin could have been asked to tone it all down, that Sylv could have been scripted and directed to play off the 'mysterious Doctor' side and as for PD, I'm fine with his portrayal. All three actors have done well in the Big Finish Audios, as has Paul McGann for me... Maybe JNT again, standing off to one side in the recording sessions adding his 'direction ideas?'
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby iank » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:04 pm

Davison is the closest, but I like them all.
80s Who kicked ass.
(Doctor Who) has been hijacked and redefined as a lucrative modern franchise. They've literally taken a square peg and painfully made it fit a round hole by taking enormous liberties with much of its fundamental essence. There's no turning back now.

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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:42 pm

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The '80's Doctors Meet Davros: A trilogy of clips........


In which our trio show whether they can stand toe to bumper with an iconic villain!:











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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby LizR » Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:09 am

I must get around to watching all of 80s Who one day. The episodes I've seen have been rather variable, and I don't feel I'm qualified to answer this question.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:08 pm

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When UK Gold got round to covering the '80's Docs on the show's 40th anniversary.......








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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:41 pm

....... and a NEWSNIGHT item asking if the entire 1980's was rubbish?





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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Sun Dec 08, 2019 11:50 am

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When JNT passed, I remember trying to explain to a friend who he was and what he had done for it to impact on me so.

"He cast the 1980's Doctors", was about all I could think of that he might engage with.

His response was immediate. He became instantly dismissive.

"Ah, the 1980's Doctors were ****!"

And that was the end of that.

It did make me wonder if - while we as fans often see the potential (sometimes hidden, sometimes realised) of the three actors in question and can appreciate what they were at least striving to do in the role - whether the public at large had less patience for any unrealised potential than we did?

First impressions last, of course, and Episode 1 of DILEMMA and TIME AND THE RANI might well have been all that a lot of the public needed to see before dismissing that particular Doctor for good? No second chances.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby rapscallion » Sun Dec 08, 2019 9:30 pm

Cygnus Prime wrote:First impressions last, of course, and Episode 1 on DILEMMA and TIME AND THE RANI might well have been all that a lot of the public needed to see before dismissing that particular Doctor for good? No second chances.


Have to admit, that was exactly what happened to me with Sylvester McCoy. I'd been a massive fan of Colin Baker and his era, so I was already feeling bruised on Colin's behalf with all the news that he had been replaced. I tuned in to see part one of Time And The Rani on transmission (the title alone sounded tripe) and was just mortified by this new Doctor and McCoy's performance, not to mention the rest of the story. I switched off at the end of part one and decided that, at the ripe old age of 13, I must have outgrown my favourite programme

For several years I carried on with the belief that Sylvester McCoy was awful in the role, purely because of my first impressions, and apart from catching a few glimpses when flicking the channels I never watched the rest of his tenure. It was only when 'The Curse Of Fenric' was released on video that I watched him again and re-assessed my opinion off the back of that.

My opinion of Time And The Rani has never changed. I find it practically unwatchable, the worst story in the first 26years. But my appreciation of McCoy has grown, particularly through enjoying a lot of his Big Finish output with Bonnie, Sophie and Philip Olivier.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Sat Dec 28, 2019 7:58 pm

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ERIC SAWARD:

He lacks that certain quality that I think the part demands. Troughton had it. Tom Baker certainly had it - in bucketloads. Peter didn't really have it, but Peter's a good actor, so he brought a certain something to the role. And Colin...? Well, Colin's a fair character actor. But not really a leading man. Not for something as big as this.



Was Eric right when he made these comments (on the Trials and Tribulations Documentary)?

Or unfair?


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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:24 pm

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A Davison music suite......


Spoiler: Toggle
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See also.......

Classic Who Incidental Music Thread:

http://www.planetmondas.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=6848

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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:28 pm

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Sixth Doctor Suite:


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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:33 pm

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McCoy Suite:


Spoiler: Toggle
phpBB © 2011



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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Cygnus Prime » Sat Mar 07, 2020 3:55 pm

rapscallion wrote:
Cygnus Prime wrote:First impressions last, of course, and Episode 1 on DILEMMA and TIME AND THE RANI might well have been all that a lot of the public needed to see before dismissing that particular Doctor for good? No second chances.


Have to admit, that was exactly what happened to me with Sylvester McCoy. I'd been a massive fan of Colin Baker and his era, so I was already feeling bruised on Colin's behalf with all the news that he had been replaced. I tuned in to see part one of Time And The Rani on transmission (the title alone sounded tripe) and was just mortified by this new Doctor and McCoy's performance, not to mention the rest of the story. I switched off at the end of part one and decided that, at the ripe old age of 13, I must have outgrown my favourite programme

For several years I carried on with the belief that Sylvester McCoy was awful in the role, purely because of my first impressions, and apart from catching a few glimpses when flicking the channels I never watched the rest of his tenure. It was only when 'The Curse Of Fenric' was released on video that I watched him again and re-assessed my opinion off the back of that.

My opinion of Time And The Rani has never changed. I find it practically unwatchable, the worst story in the first 26years. But my appreciation of McCoy has grown, particularly through enjoying a lot of his Big Finish output with Bonnie, Sophie and Philip Olivier.



Funnily enough, I kind of preferred the twee McCoy Doctor (and perhaps even stories) of Season 24 to his Dark Chess-Playing Doctor of seasons 25-26.

Just felt they were a breath of fresh air after the years of Saward's bloodbaths.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby DSJR » Sat Mar 07, 2020 5:07 pm

Compared with what we've had lately, the 80's Doctors were in a different league...

Just sayin'
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby paulhickling » Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:43 pm

All of them. Except Peter Davison was good. Colin gave a 'wrong' performance and McCoy struggled to be an actor.

Oddly though recently, I told a McCoy fan good friend of mine that the difference between McCoy and Jodie W is, she can act, but McCoy is a Doctor. And I'd probably say the same about Colin..
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby Kranger » Fri May 22, 2020 6:42 am

I’ve always said the first four actors were perfectly cast. I’ll leave it at that.
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Re: Were Any of the 1980's Doctors Miscast?

Postby paulhickling » Fri May 22, 2020 5:15 pm

Kranger wrote:I’ve always said the first four actors were perfectly cast. I’ll leave it at that.


Quoted for truth.
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