Rate "The Lie of the Land"

For discussion of series 10 of Doctor Who starring Peter Capaldi

Rate "The Lie of the Land"

10
2
2%
9
2
2%
8
7
8%
7
14
16%
6
5
6%
5
9
10%
4
18
21%
3
8
9%
2
7
8%
1
14
16%
 
Total votes : 86

Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby chap with wings » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:10 am

Really poor script that the regulars shone in. Plot made no sense at all unless I am missing something.....
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Servorobot » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:44 am

Hmm, it was just ok.

The plot made no sense at all and the Monks gave up with a whimper, but the whole thing was a rather unsatisfying ending to the "Monks Trilogy".

Couldn't find any reference to Bill being gay though.

4/10.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby LizR » Sun Jun 04, 2017 12:30 pm

That was kind of OK for a while, in a "what's going on?" sort of way, but for me at least it jumped the shark around the point where Bill shot the Doctor. (And was it just me, or did it have a lot of background noise, including the music which was often rather obtrusive?)

The Missy was a waste of time, and as for the resolution, dear God!

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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby The Ginger Cat » Sun Jun 04, 2017 12:45 pm

Keep the chat about the overnights here please guys: Series 10 Ratings thread. Thanks kindly.

P.S You'll find some posts of yours have already been moved from here to there.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby -JMW- » Sun Jun 04, 2017 12:53 pm

LizR wrote:That was kind of OK for a while, in a "what's going on?" sort of way, but for me at least it jumped the shark around the point where Bill shot the Doctor. (And was it just me, or did it have a lot of background noise, including the music which was often rather obtrusive?)
And who has cassette players nowadays?

People who aren't permitted access to any form of historical information? (as mentioned in the ep).
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby TheDentistOfDavros » Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:08 pm

Didn't like it at all. I was a bit confused by the bland "love will save us all" ending, is Bill's mum now responsible for everything in history? Is she now greeting Neil Armstrong on the moon? The monks were hardly in it and what effect did "Extremis" have on this story?

3/10 really disappointed and probably the worst of the series so far. Next week looks good though!
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Michael_7677 » Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:52 pm

5/10 for me...weakest in the series so far.

Did Missy reference Traken at the end? I wasn't fully paying attention by the end?
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby shuzbot » Sun Jun 04, 2017 3:40 pm

http://www.doctorwho.tv/whats-new/artic ... g-fu-monks

“Early on, it was very different and they were kung-fu monks that were going to be physical and fighting. Later on that evolved into the thinkers and the schemers and the mind-controllers – the idea shifts and evolves.”
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby lepter » Sun Jun 04, 2017 3:51 pm

Well.....a low 3 from me. The previous two wernt too bad. This last one was just like watching martha save the world from the master. In fact i would say that this was just a poor rehash of the other 3 parter that did this much better in the tenant years. Doctor hidden away....check. signal sent through satelites/statues..check. companion finds doctor..check. love saves the day...check. same story with variations on the tropes.

A low point in an otherwise very good season.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby -JMW- » Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:16 pm

lepter wrote:Well.....a low 3 from me. The previous two wernt too bad. This last one was just like watching martha save the world from the master. In fact i would say that this was just a poor rehash of the other 3 parter that did this much better in the tenant years. Doctor hidden away....check. signal sent through satelites/statues..check. companion finds doctor..check. love saves the day...check. same story with variations on the tropes.

A low point in an otherwise very good season.

To be fair, the Doctor found the companion and Nardole brought her to him (and it was early on).
I think many of us envisioned "Last of the Timelords" when we saw the trailer featuring Bill on the boat....but it wasn't like that at all in the episode.

Bill's reaction to the Doctor "turning bad" was one of my favourite moments in a Doctor Who story....so intensely played, the sense of betrayal oozed from the actress.

The signal seemed to work in the opposite way to "Last of the Timelords"....the people of Earth focused their combined minds on the Doctor, which was amplified through the archangel satellite network (resulting in the awful "Jesus" moment)....
...but in "Lie of the Land" we had only Bill focusing her mind and disrupting the existing signal to humanity (aided by the purity of the untainted memories of her mother that the Doctor had strengthened via the photos...presumably the Monks could not account for the Doctor's random time-travel act of kindness).
All nonsense of course, but so much of Doctor Who has always been glorious nonsense.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby lepter » Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:14 pm

-JMW- wrote:
lepter wrote:Well.....a low 3 from me. The previous two wernt too bad. This last one was just like watching martha save the world from the master. In fact i would say that this was just a poor rehash of the other 3 parter that did this much better in the tenant years. Doctor hidden away....check. signal sent through satelites/statues..check. companion finds doctor..check. love saves the day...check. same story with variations on the tropes.

A low point in an otherwise very good season.

To be fair, the Doctor found the companion and Nardole brought her to him (and it was early on).
I think many of us envisioned "Last of the Timelords" when we saw the trailer featuring Bill on the boat....but it wasn't like that at all in the episode.

Bill's reaction to the Doctor "turning bad" was one of my favourite moments in a Doctor Who story....so intensely played, the sense of betrayal oozed from the actress.

The signal seemed to work in the opposite way to "Last of the Timelords"....the people of Earth focused their combined minds on the Doctor, which was amplified through the archangel satellite network (resulting in the awful "Jesus" moment)....
...but in "Lie of the Land" we had only Bill focusing her mind and disrupting the existing signal to humanity (aided by the purity of the untainted memories of her mother that the Doctor had strengthened via the photos...presumably the Monks could not account for the Doctor's random time-travel act of kindness).
All nonsense of course, but so much of Doctor Who has always been glorious nonsense.

Basic story was just the same though. You think the monks would have been watching bill like a hawk if she was the lynchpin to their invasion.
Even had the whole world forgetting it ever happened at the end. A lame payoff in a three parter. I agree with the bad doctor thing but would the monks have needed him to convince everyone of the good monks with the broadcasts. Whynot just go to missy anyway and forget bill. Just didnt hang together very well.
I have better hopes for the next one.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby -JMW- » Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:34 pm

lepter wrote:Basic story was just the same though. You think the monks would have been watching bill like a hawk if she was the lynchpin to their invasion.

Well yeah, they could have set her up with a swish lifestyle...i know I'd go along with it all if they gave me a million bucks and a lifetime of protection for my entire family tree. :D

But I suppose it's like in the Matrix....these Monks have done this many times so they know what works and what doesn't. Missy also explained that if the plan doesn't work out they just go "meh!" and move on to the next world.

Not sure about the Pyramid or them giving the Doc back his sight though...just maybe it'll be explained in the next few weeks....not holding out hope though.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby DSJR » Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:45 pm

All too often over the last few years, I find myself swinging wildly from loving one moment and despising the next! I found this episode just like that and the ending was awful. I've given it a 5, but have very mixed feelings about it to be honest.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Sid Rat » Sun Jun 04, 2017 6:50 pm

-JMW- wrote:All nonsense of course, but so much of Doctor Who has always been glorious nonsense.

Indeed. Unfortunately this one forgot the 'glorious' part. ;)

lepter wrote:I have better hopes for the next one.

Me too.

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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby -JMW- » Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:19 pm

Sid Rat wrote:I hope they make the Ice Warriors a complex culture rather than a typical monster. One aspect I always liked about them was that they weren't always just the 'bad guys'. In their first appearance they were motivated by survival and saw the humans and their ioniser as a threat. Then in the first Peladon story we were led to believe they were behind everything when in fact they were just innocent members of the Federation. This made a refreshing change from the likes of the Daleks and Cybermen who can't be reasoned with.

Oh and I also hope they don't keep having Ice Warriors removing their helmets. I didn't like them ruining that mystery in their first appearance in the new series.

Here lies the problem. When one has been a fan for a number of years it's difficult to "switch off" and let the story-teller do the story-telling. Expectations, once set in, can turn to disappointment.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Nosey Neighbour » Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:43 pm

This story arc had the usual overcomplicated plotting and then the highly sophisticated foe is easily vanquished by love - we've seen this too often in recent series. The Doctor tucked away on a ship was silly and The Monks ultimately disappointed. Nardole seems a pointless addition to the crew and my initial enthusiam for Bill is seriously on the wane

I pushed my mark up to 4 because I liked the gun battle. To make the threat credible, root it into a familiar setting against the best Earth can pitch at it.

I'm looking forward to the Gatiss story next week. I like his writing and his stories are rooted in old school themes.

The Guardian Doctor Who blog writer seems in touch with views expressed here and elsewhere online. I wish the production team would also pay attention because I'm growing concerned that the show is starting to wither unless they can keep it fresh and still garner mainstream appeal. It's no good writing Doctor Who for an audience of Moffats.
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Servorobot » Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:28 pm

Nosey Neighbour wrote:This story arc had the usual overcomplicated plotting and then the highly sophisticated foe is easily vanquished by love - we've seen this too often in recent series. The Doctor tucked away on a ship was silly and The Monks ultimately disappointed. Nardole seems a pointless addition to the crew and my initial enthusiam for Bill is seriously on the wane

I pushed my mark up to 4 because I liked the gun battle. To make the threat credible, root it into a familiar setting against the best Earth can pitch at it.

I'm looking forward to the Gatiss story next week. I like his writing and his stories are rooted in old school themes.

The Guardian Doctor Who blog writer seems in touch with views expressed here and elsewhere online. I wish the production team would also pay attention because I'm growing concerned that the show is starting to wither unless they can keep it fresh and still garner mainstream appeal. It's no good writing Doctor Who for an audience of Moffats.


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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby JPS » Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:09 pm

I thought it was complete garbage. Its great to have a three parter, great to have a nice slower pace storytelling. Capaldi fabulous. The problem for me was that it was a dull story with dull monsters. The ending once again just pathetic. Frustratingly next week we are getting the Ice Warriors in just 1 episode !!!! :( It looks to be a better story that deserves 2 parts !!! Why does NewWho constantly bloody frustrate me ????
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby iank » Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:43 pm

Hmm, well that was all a bit of a waste of time, wasn't it? It wasn't absolutely terrible or anything, but it all felt very rushed, half-baked and under-developed. As someone on another forum has noted, we've just had the equivalent of an old school six-parter - more than 2 hours of screen time - and yet there wasn't so much as one interesting and fully developed guest character in the entire thing. And the monks ended up a bit much ado about nothing as well.
Frankly, I suspect Moffat had the idea for Extremis and then had no particular idea of where to go with it from the end. Meh. 4. :(
Still, ice Warriors next week. Let's hope Gatiss was having one of his good days...
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Re: Rate "The Lie of the Land"

Postby Llamastrangler » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:22 pm

It says a lot that an episode this good, with not an awful lot wrong with it, should be my least favourite of this excellent season so far. Fantastic concept, perfect for our age of "fake news"... http://llamastranglermarathon.blogspot. ... d.html?m=1
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