So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:26 am

The Nimon wrote:
paulhickling wrote:Actually Bacon is one of a growing number of US actors who I wouldn't be devastated if he was announced. Alongside Johnny Depp and (in older times of course) Gene Wilder. There are people. And much preferred to a woman! After all, THREE iconic american characters have now been played by a Brit. And one who is an alien just like our fave.

At best guess I'd say Batman and Superman. Not sure about the third, is it Lincoln?

Those are iconic American characters?!


I mean yes, of course Lincoln is, but a couple of power fantasy semi-fascists who like dressing up, ffs?!


...actually yes I suppose that is about as iconically American as you can get nowadays, seeing their treatment of any 3rd world villages they don't like, Bradley Manning and anyone else who tries to tell the world the truth, and so on. :roll:
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Allons-y » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:11 am

LizR wrote:
The Nimon wrote:
paulhickling wrote:Actually Bacon is one of a growing number of US actors who I wouldn't be devastated if he was announced. Alongside Johnny Depp and (in older times of course) Gene Wilder. There are people. And much preferred to a woman! After all, THREE iconic american characters have now been played by a Brit. And one who is an alien just like our fave.

At best guess I'd say Batman and Superman. Not sure about the third, is it Lincoln?

Those are iconic American characters?!


I mean yes, of course Lincoln is, but a couple of power fantasy semi-fascists who like dressing up, ffs?!


...actually yes I suppose that is about as iconically American as you can get nowadays, seeing their treatment of any 3rd world villages they don't like, Bradley Manning and anyone else who tries to tell the world the truth, and so on. :roll:

you make dressing up sound like a bad thing :P
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby paulhickling » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:04 am

Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Allons-y » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:23 am

paulhickling wrote:Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.

I haven't read the books, but from what I've heard of them, I get the impression that the Song of Ice and Fire books were already pretty sexual, although HBO does tend to sex things up as you put it, on the whole I think Game of Thrones is really good though.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby paulhickling » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:21 am

Allons-y wrote:
paulhickling wrote:Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.

I haven't read the books, but from what I've heard of them, I get the impression that the Song of Ice and Fire books were already pretty sexual, although HBO does tend to sex things up as you put it, on the whole I think Game of Thrones is really good though.


The same friend who lent me the series, did say they were already sexual, but this was increased for the series. I do admit to finding it addictive. I found myself being glad I didn't have to wait for each next episode to see what happened next, the test of a good serial of course.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:30 am

Allons-y wrote:you make dressing up sound like a bad thing :P

That's the best bit, I have to admit. Especially in those tight rubber suits.....





...excuse me a mo
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:34 am

paulhickling wrote:Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.

Something set in a pseudo medieval world should respect the conventions of such a world, in which there was no contraception and a strong likelihood of death in childbirth, so obviously women had to be a little bit more careful than nowadays about who, where and when... I haven't seen GOT but anything set in such a world that tries to "modernise" it would get a big thumbs down from me. Also, the swearing would not be sexual but religious (as is also true of the "Wild West" by the way). To the people of that time, swearing by saying 'f*ck' would seem odd or ludicrous, while mentioning God's wounds would be shocking.
"I’m mentioning these things now not in an attempt to garner sympathy, but out of solidarity with the huge numbers of women who have histories like mine, who’ve been slurred as bigots for having concerns around single-sex spaces” — J.K.Rowling

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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Allons-y » Tue Jun 25, 2013 12:22 pm

LizR wrote:
paulhickling wrote:Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.

Something set in a pseudo medieval world should respect the conventions of such a world, in which there was no contraception and a strong likelihood of death in childbirth, so obviously women had to be a little bit more careful than nowadays about who, where and when... I haven't seen GOT but anything set in such a world that tries to "modernise" it would get a big thumbs down from me. Also, the swearing would not be sexual but religious (as is also true of the "Wild West" by the way). To the people of that time, swearing by saying 'f*ck' would seem odd or ludicrous, while mentioning God's wounds would be shocking.

Well given that you haven't seen it (or I presume read it), you could be forgiving for thinking that a medieval fantasy would follow the model of our history and be a basically Christian civilization, but no they worship 7 gods following the "faith of the seven" so their religion is quite different.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby paulhickling » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:59 pm

Yes, I would go along with the idea that if it's all made up, then really yes it's fine. You either like it or you don't. I've said what I think, but if you totally make up a whole world then maybe you do have the right to do whatever you want.

It's sort of medieval, but it's not especially Earth medieval. But I certainly would never want 'our' show to go down such an 'adult' route. I'm not offended (otherwise how could I carry on watching it?), so much as annoyed. We really don't need this. Classically set stuff gets the oldies interested, yet they seem to feel the need to engage some adolescent crowd that won't watch unless there's overt sex and language. To be honest is this demographic (or whatever it's called) really that bothered as long as it has the latest stars, and there's a bit of glamour etc in it? Aren't they nightclubbing or something anyway? Lol.

Really, Merlin telling someone to "piss off" just annoys the hell out of me, when I know the material generally speaking is so much better than this. As for Morgana (or is it Margan in Camelot?) being shoved up the arse (or at least doggy style) as a punishment. Dear oh dear...

And they say Doctor Who is dumbing down.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:39 pm

Allons-y wrote:
LizR wrote:
paulhickling wrote:Game of Thrones is fine, I watched all the first two series in quick succession after being lent it by a friend. It's all pretty good except for the swearing and overt sexual content. I'm sure it's my age, and prudish nature perhaps, but somehow 'sexing' this stuff up for me does the opposite of making it adult. Makes it feel juvenile to me. Same thing annoyed me about Torchwood and Chibnall's Camelot, which apart from these objections had a much better tone and atmosphere than Merlin. Watched John Boorman's Excalibur last night and it had just the right level of 'adult' for me.

Something set in a pseudo medieval world should respect the conventions of such a world, in which there was no contraception and a strong likelihood of death in childbirth, so obviously women had to be a little bit more careful than nowadays about who, where and when... I haven't seen GOT but anything set in such a world that tries to "modernise" it would get a big thumbs down from me. Also, the swearing would not be sexual but religious (as is also true of the "Wild West" by the way). To the people of that time, swearing by saying 'f*ck' would seem odd or ludicrous, while mentioning God's wounds would be shocking.

Well given that you haven't seen it (or I presume read it), you could be forgiving for thinking that a medieval fantasy would follow the model of our history and be a basically Christian civilization, but no they worship 7 gods following the "faith of the seven" so their religion is quite different.

So what? Medieval conditions would be similar, which was my point. The gods they swear by is a detail.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:41 pm

paulhickling wrote:Really, Merlin telling someone to "piss off" just annoys the hell out of me, when I know the material generally speaking is so much better than this. As for Morgana (or is it Margan in Camelot?) being shoved up the arse (or at least doggy style) as a punishment. Dear oh dear...

Latter sounds quite medieval...
It helps one suspend disbelief if they talk in some manner that isn't 21st century English. E.g. LOTR tends to be poetic/biblical in tone, "Jane and the Dragon" avoids contractions (is not rather than isn't) etc.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Allons-y » Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:20 am

LizR wrote:So what? Medieval conditions would be similar, which was my point. The gods they swear by is a detail.

Sorry, I completely misread what you were saying. Yeah their curses do reflect their religion somewhat, however f*ck etc are also common.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Deleted User 4238 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:37 am

The Missing Episode thread is about... well anything you like really and the 12th Doctor thread is now about Game of Thrones - and televisions drama's increasing application of modern language, moralities and sensibilities within historical settings. A discussion on the boundaries and limits of credible acceptance.

This is so fluid and mixed up - and not like GB. I like.

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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby LizR » Wed Jun 26, 2013 5:55 am

Allons-y wrote:
LizR wrote:So what? Medieval conditions would be similar, which was my point. The gods they swear by is a detail.

Sorry, I completely misread what you were saying. Yeah their curses do reflect their religion somewhat, however f*ck etc are also common.

My theory is there was no middle class to be shocked by sexual references, which everyone used (Shakespeare is a good example, indeed even his name is... "Willy Shake spear" ? Come on! :lol: )

Er, anyway, where was I....? Oh yes, the class structure was completely different, there was no concept of bourgeois values (but there were courtly love and chivalry) etc etc. Any decent (I mean good) medieval style world should reflect the historical forces that shaped it, which will tend to be similar to ours. Actually I reckon Monty Python did the best job of getting this right. Burn the witch! :mrgreen:
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby Allons-y » Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:02 am

Mr Ron wrote:The Missing Episode thread is about... well anything you like really and the 12th Doctor thread is now about Game of Thrones - and televisions drama's increasing application of modern language, moralities and sensibilities within historical settings. A discussion on the boundaries and limits of credible acceptance.

This is so fluid and mixed up - and not like GB. I like.

:D

We like to keep things fresh. :D

LizR wrote:
Allons-y wrote:
LizR wrote:So what? Medieval conditions would be similar, which was my point. The gods they swear by is a detail.

Sorry, I completely misread what you were saying. Yeah their curses do reflect their religion somewhat, however f*ck etc are also common.

My theory is there was no middle class to be shocked by sexual references, which everyone used (Shakespeare is a good example, indeed even his name is... "Willy Shake spear" ? Come on! :lol: )

Er, anyway, where was I....? Oh yes, the class structure was completely different, there was no concept of bourgeois values (but there were courtly love and chivalry) etc etc. Any decent (I mean good) medieval style world should reflect the historical forces that shaped it, which will tend to be similar to ours. Actually I reckon Monty Python did the best job of getting this right. Burn the witch! :mrgreen:

I do like The Holy Grail.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby paulhickling » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:00 pm

Well, this is all the art of conversation isn't it? I wouldn't have even thought of mentioning GoT if someone else hadn't, and before you know it, because half a dozen posts go by it looks like a way off topic discussion. But it would be rather dull if we were so puritanical about Who that all other subjects were banned!

It all quite sweetly reminds me of the days when we were still having DWAS local group meetings in the 80s, when some folks (usually munchkins - our word for the younger members - we were a hard bunch) moaned a bit because some of us would start talking about The Prisoner/Gerry Anderson stuff etc. It wasn't as if we were insisting EVERYONE had to join in (though of course if they did and were clever enough they could easily veer the talk back to Who)!

If those kids had had the power to gag us Time Screen might never have existed, and the world would've been a sorrier place!
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby chasersbass » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:18 pm

what happened to the last couple of days posts?
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby ianj » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:25 pm

Hahaaa, it's the powah!!! of Mondas!! The POWAH!!!!
We don't fanny about here on Mondas,talk and post what you like,when you like.We are read all around the World, you know.I am on tablets,you know...
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby ReganMacNeilfan » Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:12 am

If 12 is terrible I won't even watch him or buy the box set.
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Re: So who's going to be the 12th Doctor

Postby iank » Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:41 am

That's what they all say. :D
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